Take this with a (Persian) grain of salt
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Joined: March 26, 2002
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Take this with a (Persian) grain of salt
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Posted on Sat Nov 23, 2019 4:44 pm || Last edited by Chainmailbasket_com on Sun Nov 24, 2019 2:27 pm; edited 1 time in total
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(Edit: fixed an error- Staggered grain crosses itself as what ended up as “Staggered Double Half Persian 3 in 1”. It’s very nice in an AR of 5.7)

This is an excerpt from an upcoming article I'm working on. A few things were changed to ####, or ?? so there's at least some mystery surrounding this. Pictures won't show up either, but obviously will in the final product.

I thought I'd share these findings in case anyone wants to try out any of the other possibilities. I'm certain other maillers have made similar discoveries.

[----------------]

[pic=kylix.jpg]
####: Kylix Chain
.048" (1.22mm) stainless steel
AR of 5.7

Kylix Chain is from the Persian family and along one grain has similar layering to that found in Double Half Persian 3 in 1, Persian Split (item ####, April), and Staggered Persian Elven Rope, a segment of the last mentioned off which this chain sample was continued (Fig ??). The other grain is the same as what is used in gallery item Full Persian Alternate Twist, by ZiLi.

[pic=staggered_persian_elvenrope_vs_kylix.jpg]
Fig ??: Staggered Persian Elvenrope to Kylix Chain conversion.

Have I weaved this before? There are so many Persian chain possibilities with two different choices of grain. At this point I put together a list of Full Persian grain types, and also this layered one to explore any further possibilities. (My at home version is a spreadsheet.)


Fig ??: Full/Layered Persian grain types.

[----------------]

Over the last few weeks, I've made 27 variants that aren't in the MAIL weave library!

And here's another food for thought: How many Hilt Chain possibilities does this bring to the table?


There is no such thing as weave ownership. If someone produces a weave sample, they own that physical piece of mail, but not rights to the weave pattern itself.
Chainmailbasket.com (2019-01-01) - 376 + 79

Joined: August 05, 2010
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Location: Bar Harbor, ME, USA

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Posted on Sat Nov 23, 2019 5:37 pm
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When I submitted Cloudy Day, it was found to be super similar to a theoretical Hawkskaede-sheet (currently still not submitted). Even more food for thought would be the sheet versions of every single chain.


while(!project.isFinished())
project.addRing();
// Maille Code V2.0 T7.1 R5.6 Eo.n Fper MFe.s Wsm Caws G0.8-1.6 I2.4-8.0 Pn Dcdejst Xw1 S07

Joined: March 26, 2002
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Location: Chainmailland, Chainmailia

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Posted on Sun Nov 24, 2019 2:33 pm
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TrenchCoatGuy wrote:
When I submitted Cloudy Day, it was found to be super similar to a theoretical Hawkskaede-sheet (currently still not submitted). Even more food for thought would be the sheet versions of every single chain.


I practically drool at the number of possibilities. Once in awhile I think about how neat it would be to design as many theoretical weaves as possible using 3D modelling, and then pick which ones to make.


There is no such thing as weave ownership. If someone produces a weave sample, they own that physical piece of mail, but not rights to the weave pattern itself.
Chainmailbasket.com (2019-01-01) - 376 + 79

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Posted on Sun Nov 24, 2019 3:26 pm
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@Chainmailbasket_com Talking about 3d modeling and Persian variants, a while back I found a progression of Flat Full Persian that I don't have the rings for myself. Basically it's two HP5-1 chains mixed together instead of two HP3-1 chains. Send me a pm if you'd like to try it.



Joined: March 26, 2002
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Location: Chainmailland, Chainmailia

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Posted on Sun Nov 24, 2019 3:56 pm
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JanPieter wrote:
@Chainmailbasket_com Talking about 3d modeling and Persian variants, a while back I found a progression of Flat Full Persian that I don't have the rings for myself. Basically it's two HP5-1 chains mixed together instead of two HP3-1 chains. Send me a pm if you'd like to try it.


What an interesting coincidence. Mere moments ago I was looking at Full Flat Persian 7 in 1 Chain, trying to figure out which HPs to use. Looks like HP3 & HP4 with the HP3s being of the same handedness, in contrast to Syringa 7 in 1 Chain, in which they have opposite chirality.

Which HP divides the HP5s in the progression you found? I’m pretty sure I could figure it out with just that info.


There is no such thing as weave ownership. If someone produces a weave sample, they own that physical piece of mail, but not rights to the weave pattern itself.
Chainmailbasket.com (2019-01-01) - 376 + 79

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Posts: 113
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Location: Rotterdam

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Posted on Sun Nov 24, 2019 4:11 pm
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FFP7-1 is for me in 3d two HP3-1 put together. Having made FFP5-1, FFP6-1 and FFP7-1 in 3d in that manner I figured I'd try the same using two HP5-1s. So I don't understand what you're asking Very Happy

Here are some pics:



I have rendered a tutorial for it.

Iirc every ring goes around two eyes instead of one, if that makes sense.



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Posted on Sun Nov 24, 2019 4:31 pm
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FFP5-1 divides HP3 chains with HP2 connections.
FFP7-1 divides HP3 chains with HP4 connections (haven’t yet confirmed this, and description doesn’t mention it).

Each of these has a version where its 2 HP3 chains are of opposite handedness. They are Syringa (5 in 1), and Syringa 7 in 1 Chain, respectively.

I’m not yet sure what goes on with Flat Full Persian, which is the 6-1 chain.


There is no such thing as weave ownership. If someone produces a weave sample, they own that physical piece of mail, but not rights to the weave pattern itself.
Chainmailbasket.com (2019-01-01) - 376 + 79

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Posted on Mon Nov 25, 2019 9:10 am
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It's a 9 in 1 weave so I guess HP4 connections.

Iirc I tried to make a Syringa version but I couldn't make it by just mirroring one of the HP5-1 chains. When making FFP in 3D you can just flip one HP3-1 chain to get Syringa. It might still be possible but would take a little bit more work to check, probably easier to check IRL.



Joined: March 26, 2002
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Posted on Mon Dec 30, 2019 7:16 pm
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Chainmailbasket_com wrote:
The other grain is the same as what is used in gallery item Full Persian Alternate Twist, by ZiLi.


It appears as though FP Alt Twist is actually in the weaves library as Mycenaean.


There is no such thing as weave ownership. If someone produces a weave sample, they own that physical piece of mail, but not rights to the weave pattern itself.
Chainmailbasket.com (2019-01-01) - 376 + 79

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Posted on Wed Jan 08, 2020 12:11 am
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Chainmailbasket_com wrote:
Chainmailbasket_com wrote:
The other grain is the same as what is used in gallery item Full Persian Alternate Twist, by ZiLi.


It appears as though FP Alt Twist is actually in the weaves library as Mycenaean.


Nice find!

We should make a full list of these, more availiable than What we have right now.


Total Nerd: MScDS, Mailler, Gamer.

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