Attaching Scale to a weave
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Joined: July 10, 2015
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Location: Conroe, TX

Attaching Scale to a weave
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Posted on Mon Jul 13, 2015 2:34 pm
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To start this off, I am new to this art so, please, bear with me as I learn and become an inquisitive idiot (because there are no stupid questions, right?) at times.

My problem is this: I am making mail pouches for personal use at a RenFest that I attend... Not that that had any bearing on my problem -sorry... What I mean to say is... How do I go about attaching scales to a piece that I have already woven? I am usually pretty good about visualizing how to do something... But this isn't one of those things. I feel that adding scales would make my pieces flashier and would really like to learn. Help a newbie out?

Thanks for your time. I apologize if there is another topic mirroring this one, I spent quite a bit of time perusing the forum and did not find anything.

Joined: August 05, 2010
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Posted on Mon Jul 13, 2015 11:12 pm
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The best way to think about scales is...

They are only rings with a big lump on one side.
Knowing that, they can quite easily just replace rings right where they are.

Unfortunately, that means you'll pretty much unweave the entire pouch just to add the scales. Additionally, you may need to redo the entire pouch anyway (to change the ring directions) to have your scales lay the direction you want.


while(!project.isFinished())
project.addRing();
// Maille Code V2.0 T7.1 R5.6 Eo.n Fper MFe.s Wsm Caws G0.8-1.6 I2.4-8.0 Pn Dcdejst Xw1 S07

Joined: July 10, 2015
Posts: 4
Submissions: 1
Location: Conroe, TX

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Posted on Mon Jul 13, 2015 11:19 pm
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TrenchCoatGuy wrote:
Additionally, you may need to redo the entire pouch anyway (to change the ring directions) to have your scales lay the direction you want.


OK. Thanks for the info. I really appreciate it!

Another question, if you don't mind, are the rings going to want to lay

((((((((((
))))))))))
(((((((((( etc

Or the other way? The way my mind is thinking about it they would need to lay the other way.

Joined: January 17, 2013
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Posted on Mon Jul 13, 2015 11:30 pm
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If your bags are a japanese weave then you'd replace the centre rings with scales but I don't expect they are.
Take a look at my stretchy scalemail over here you'll see the yellow rings are in the same place as the scales, without the yellow rings it would be "normal" scalemail. The basic weave is just J4-1 rotated by 45 degrees using scales for the centre ring instead of a large ring.

To attach scales to an existing weave you'd use 3 (preferably 4) rings going through the scale that attach it to the underlying weave. Without knowing what the existing or underlying weave is it's hard to make a firmer suggestion. From your diagram I suspect the bags are a E4-1 weave?


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Joined: August 05, 2010
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Location: Bar Harbor, ME, USA

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Posted on Tue Jul 14, 2015 12:27 am
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Ryno wrote:
Another question, if you don't mind, are the rings going to want to lay


Personally, I think scales on a pouch would look better going this way as opposed to this way.

The first one would make the scales be up or down (depending on which rings you replace with scales). The second one would have the scales spinning around the bag (left/right).

This is a thread I made way back when I realized how scales work... unfortunately, the images for that thread have been eaten by the internet guardians (and I dont have backups).


while(!project.isFinished())
project.addRing();
// Maille Code V2.0 T7.1 R5.6 Eo.n Fper MFe.s Wsm Caws G0.8-1.6 I2.4-8.0 Pn Dcdejst Xw1 S07

Joined: July 10, 2015
Posts: 4
Submissions: 1
Location: Conroe, TX

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Posted on Tue Jul 14, 2015 1:30 am
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Levi wrote:
From your diagram I suspect the bags are a E4-1 weave?


Indeed. My weave is a e4-1, as you predicted. At the moment it seems as if all of the scales I have found require a smaller gauge and ID wire, so I won't be able to do this soon, I am just researching and getting expert advice from people that have done this longer than I have.

Joined: January 17, 2013
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Location: Probably in the garage...

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Posted on Tue Jul 14, 2015 1:26 pm
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You can do it with E4-1 but you'll probably want the sheet to hang the "wrong-way" vs "right-way". As Trench Coat Guy says scales are just rings with extra material on them. If you look at an E4-1 five-let, take out the middle ring and replace it with a scale, it's the same thing. So long as your rings can fit around the scale with a bit of slack you should be fine using the existing rings. If you wanted to tack them on to the existing weave vs integrating the scales into the existing weave then you probably do want the smallest rings you can get away with.

To clarify if you applied scales to E4-1 the "right-way" your scales will run horizontally, if the sheet is rotated to the "wrong-way" the scales will run vertically.

Hope that makes sense, as I'm still half asleep.


Mostly Harmless

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Posted on Tue Jul 14, 2015 2:28 pm
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Out of curiosity, what is the scalemaille community's solution to the hairy ball problem?

Simply omitting scales (substituting normal rings back in to the pattern) at the 'cowlick(s)'?

Joined: January 17, 2013
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Posted on Tue Jul 14, 2015 9:18 pm
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Tedronai wrote:
Out of curiosity, what is the scalemaille community's solution to the hairy ball problem?


That's a good question, I wondered about that issue prior to knowing it's called a "hairy ball problem". Off the top, it's fairly unlikely you'd be gearing up a sphere or torus with scales all the way around but when it comes to bags, I'd just omit the last few rows of scales on the bottom. The tips of the scales should still mostly cover the bottom of the bag when held, keeping up appearances.


Mostly Harmless

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