Weave AR Information Alterations
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Joined: May 07, 2008
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Posted on Tue Sep 17, 2013 10:19 pm
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Hmm. That theoretically precise value is in practice too tight, as you want to twist the chain to its well-looking Spiral shape - Thus an AR in the 6.3 to 6.5 ballpark is preferrable, as that bit of space is needed to to so.

Besides that: We should populate the 'optimal' AR field only with working EXPERIENCE data, never just calculated ones. So I'd prefer for Spiral-6in1 to set the MINIMUM field with the theoretical 6.0 (value that can be even undercut a bit, if a massively distorted, bad behaving chain is accepted), but OPTIMAL at 6.3 or 6.4, that definitely IS a working experience number.

BTW: I have practice experience with Spiral-6in1, and wove it from several ARs already. Just my 2ct...

-ZiLi-


Maille Code V2.0 T7.1 R5.6 Ep Fper MAl Ws$ Cpbsw$ G0.3-6.4 I1.0-30.0 N28.25 Ps Dacdejst Xagtw S08 Hip

Human societies are like chain mail.
A single link will be worth nothing.
A chain is of use, but will break at the weakest link.
A weak weave will have the need to replace weak links.
A strong weave will survive even with weak links included.
-'me

Joined: March 26, 2002
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Posted on Tue Sep 17, 2013 11:05 pm
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6.4 sounds good. I only changed it because someone had it set to 5.5.

I disagree about populating the minimum field with 6.0, because if its anything like it's 4-1 counterpart, it can be weaved under it's optimal minimum value.

Minimum AR should be just that. The minimum which allows infinite continuation without distortion caused to the rings themselves, regardless of what the weave ends up looking like. Bunching is normal in many cases.

You say you have several samples, do any of them dip below 6.0? I'm sure it's possible.


Tell a mailler what ring sizes to use and they'll weave for a day. Teach them AR and they'll weave forever.
Chainmailbasket.com (2016-02-10) 203 + 17

Joined: May 07, 2008
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Location: Germany, Herxheim

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Posted on Wed Sep 18, 2013 1:11 am
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Yes, as told, a bit below AR6.0 is possible but looks horrible - similar to HP3-1 that looks horrible if woven a bit below its straight-flat limit but is yet weavable, and gets a 'corkscrew' chain twist. And so AR6.0 (or even slightly above, 6.1 or so) is just the practical limit that delivers a yet distortion free Spiral-6in1, but not yet one, that can be twisted straight in a way to look good without getting a corkskrew distortion due to overtwisting at the attempt to twist it as far as needed to look like an orderly Spiral family chain. The 'sweet spot' zone of s61 begins (imho) at ~AR6.3+, to (also imho) AR6.8-7; above it begins to show another nasty behavior, to act like several independent but interwoven chains, that can be shifted as a whole against each other. This phenomenon can be seen also on higher-AR Spiral 4in1/8in2 chains. I may note, that different maillers have different preferred AR ranges, and some like to weave S61 at above AR7 - why not; it's possible...

-ZiLi-


Maille Code V2.0 T7.1 R5.6 Ep Fper MAl Ws$ Cpbsw$ G0.3-6.4 I1.0-30.0 N28.25 Ps Dacdejst Xagtw S08 Hip

Human societies are like chain mail.
A single link will be worth nothing.
A chain is of use, but will break at the weakest link.
A weak weave will have the need to replace weak links.
A strong weave will survive even with weak links included.
-'me

Joined: March 26, 2002
Posts: 1708
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Location: Chainmailland, Chainmailia

Vertigo's more accessible than you thought
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Posted on Sun Jan 19, 2014 7:25 pm
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I changed the ideal AR for Vertigo (B8FP Grizzly) from 9.0 to 7.9.

First I weaved a short length at an AR of 9.0 and got this:



I found that the outside rings flop around too much, so I tried a smaller AR. This next one was made with rings of an AR of 7.9:



Ah, much better. Still a reasonable amount of flexibility exists.

Pictures were also submitted to the gallery, along with one showing the transition of Three Quarters Persian to Full Persian 6 in 1 Grizzly to B8FPG (Vertigo).


Tell a mailler what ring sizes to use and they'll weave for a day. Teach them AR and they'll weave forever.
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Posted on Sun Jan 19, 2014 11:05 pm
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i could be wrong but your samples don't look like vertigo to me. i think in vertigo the outside links connect to the grizzly through the corners of the square not parallel the inside links. pure speculation mind you, i've never made it. if you look at the info for vertigo you will also notice you did not make boxchain on the outside and the links you did not make boxchain with did not pass through four of the inside grizzly links.

Joined: March 26, 2002
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Posted on Sun Jan 19, 2014 11:58 pm
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Oh wow. Egg on my face.

Well looks like I made something new I guess. I wondered why the Vertigo sample looked smoother. Coif LoL

In this case, I shall change back the ideal AR for Vertigo to 9.0.


Tell a mailler what ring sizes to use and they'll weave for a day. Teach them AR and they'll weave forever.
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Posted on Mon Jan 20, 2014 12:12 am
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It also stands to reason why the outside rings on my B8FP (Sand Worm) sample seemed to flop around so loosely. It turns out I did the same thing with that weave. Rolling Eyes


Tell a mailler what ring sizes to use and they'll weave for a day. Teach them AR and they'll weave forever.
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persian dragonscale??
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Posted on Sun Feb 01, 2015 8:44 am
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Did someone already pick this very very very rare weave out of the bunch? If so, please link me. I'm at my wits end and have already prematurely posted my newb first post regarding it. Yay. Then I found this. Danke.

Joined: March 26, 2002
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Posted on Sun Feb 01, 2015 2:16 pm
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link for reference (easier than searching for it):

Persian Dragonscale


Tell a mailler what ring sizes to use and they'll weave for a day. Teach them AR and they'll weave forever.
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thats not what i'm saying
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Posted on Sun Feb 01, 2015 3:42 pm
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what i'm asking is...has Persian Dragonscale AR been corrected?

Joined: March 26, 2002
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Posted on Sun Feb 01, 2015 8:08 pm
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I was simply providing a link to the weave's page so people who read this can easily get to it without having to search for it. That is all.


Tell a mailler what ring sizes to use and they'll weave for a day. Teach them AR and they'll weave forever.
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Posted on Mon Feb 02, 2015 2:47 pm
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Sherlocked, please see my reply in your other thread.



-- CGMaille tutorials now hosted here at MAIL! --

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Posted on Tue Jul 07, 2015 3:47 pm
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http://www.mailleartisans.org/board/viewtopic.php?p=237851#237851

All weaves made by snitter are made with 1.3mm wire, not 1mm as his oldest weaves say.

Link is to topic on the matter.

Joined: March 26, 2002
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Posted on Sun Dec 13, 2015 4:33 pm
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As per http://www.mailleartisans.org/board/viewtopic.php?p=239155 , 4 in 2 Captive's minimum AR as been set to 7.5, and it's ideal to 8.7, with a note in the description that lower ARs are possible using two different ring sizes.


Tell a mailler what ring sizes to use and they'll weave for a day. Teach them AR and they'll weave forever.
Chainmailbasket.com (2016-02-10) 203 + 17

Joined: March 26, 2002
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Location: Chainmailland, Chainmailia

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Posted on Tue Dec 15, 2015 3:03 am
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I'm setting the minimum AR of Hour Glass Unit at AR of 6.6. This is based on a very tight one I made in .062" 3/8" (.411" measured ID) stainless steel.

I made a few looser samples also at 7.0, 7.5, and 8.1, and was amused with their ability to be turned inside out while still retaining their form.

I guess I'm a wee bit late to the December 2011 weave study. Oh well, better late than never. Coif LoL


Tell a mailler what ring sizes to use and they'll weave for a day. Teach them AR and they'll weave forever.
Chainmailbasket.com (2016-02-10) 203 + 17

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