Coating pliers
View previous topic | View next topic >
Post new topic Reply to topic
M.A.I.L. Forum Index -> Knitting Circle
   
Author Message

Joined: January 13, 2013
Posts: 454
Submissions: 16
Location: GA

Coating pliers
Reply with quote
Posted on Sun Feb 10, 2013 2:41 am
Link to Post: Link to Post

I have a couple of different sets of pliers; one made for jewelry and one from the hardware store. Even after filing and buffing, both still mare up my BA rings.

I have read some stuff about people using masking tape and various coating type things. "Tool Magic" seems to be a popular one. I found some at my local Joann's today (surprised) and it was on sale, so I got it.

I just dipped all my pliers and have to let them dry overnight.

Anyone have any experience with the Tool Magic stuff? Or recommend something else?

Joined: July 25, 2008
Posts: 844
Submissions: 0

Reply with quote
Posted on Sun Feb 10, 2013 2:58 am
Link to Post: Link to Post

It's ok but wears through, plasti-dip from your local hardware is a cheaper option by volume and almost the same thing.
The better you get the less often you need the tape/dip.
I find matching pliers to the wire/ring size helps reduce marking the rings a lot.
I use the coatings if I don't have the right pliers in hand or if its only a small project.
What material are you working with? Soft Copper is very close to silver in terms of scratch resistant.
The softer 4043 aluminum is a cheap pratice material, to soft for chainmail but works wonderfully for wire wrapping.

Did you champher the corners of your pliers just a little?

Joined: August 30, 2008
Posts: 3064
Submissions: 20
Location: Burlington, ON, Canada

Reply with quote
Posted on Sun Feb 10, 2013 3:12 am
Link to Post: Link to Post

As I've said before more times than I can count... And I know it pisses people off, I'm sorry Sad

Tool Dip is a crutch, it's the bare facts.

There is no substitution for practice and better technique.
If you are marring up rings, you're either gripping too hard, and you're digging the edges of the pliers into the ring, or you're not gripping hard enough, and your ring is slipping.

High quality ($10) pliers, and good technique will save you from the pricey wasteful crutch that is tool dip.

I understand that it's frustrating and upsetting being told by some random name on the internet, sight unseen that "You're doing it wrong."... I get that, I really do... It's like having a Teacher back in grade school hand you back your homework with a big red X across it...
But, while we're on the homework analogy, using tool dip is akin to copying the answers from the smart kid in front of you, instead of doing the homework yourself...


My sister started making chainmail about a year ago... Being a good brother, I had two pairs of Xuron 475s ($10 a pair, best pliers you'll ever buy) and some rings mailed to her house... A week or two later, she phoned me complaining that the miracle pliers I'd bought her were scratching her AA, and asked me about Tool Dip.
I said the same thing to her then that I say now... You may need to lightly file the edges of the pliers with an emery board (I see you've already done that) after that, it's in your technique... Expect to mangle some rings as you're learning the correct pressure, after that it will come naturally and you won't need to think about it.


...

TL;DR: Buy some toothless Xuron 475s ($10 a pair) and expect to mangle some rings as you practice... But practice!



Joined: January 13, 2013
Posts: 454
Submissions: 16
Location: GA

Reply with quote
Posted on Sun Feb 10, 2013 3:58 am
Link to Post: Link to Post

Thanks Daemon_Lotos Smile

I have thought that it is gripping too hard in some cases (my husband suggested the same thing), but it is usually with the larger/stiffer rings. So maybe I just need better pliers?

I know in other cases it is that the rings or pliers slip; mostly like with smaller pieces where it is hard to get in there to grip the rings. I even have a pair of small tip chain nose pliers that I thought would help.

Maybe it is just me; I am still new at this and while I seem to be learning some of the weaves quickly, I am sure I still have lots to learn as far as technique.

So I am open to tips and critique, just be gentle with me Wink

Joined: December 22, 2007
Posts: 4610
Submissions: 106
Location: Hampton, Virginia USA

Reply with quote
Posted on Sun Feb 10, 2013 4:43 am
Link to Post: Link to Post

Yeah, I really do have to agree with DL. Part of the "art" of making chainmaille is learning how to use your tools appropriately without relying on "crutches".


"I am a leaf on the wind." ~ Wash
Lorraine's Chains
Gallery Submission Guidelines

Joined: April 02, 2008
Posts: 2246
Submissions: 42
Location: Lincoln, NE

Reply with quote
Posted on Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:17 pm
Link to Post: Link to Post

Mailleing with crutches...Now that I would like to see. Very Happy


Once you stop learning, you stop living, so...
Ask questions.
Try new things.
Share what you know.

MailleCode V2.0 T5.3 R4.4 E0.0 Feur MFe.sBr Wg Cwb G.7-5.1 I3.1-11 N20.5 Pj Dcdjt Xa1w2 S08

Joined: May 08, 2010
Posts: 1156
Submissions: 11
Location: Chesapeake, VA, USA

Reply with quote
Posted on Mon Feb 11, 2013 6:30 pm
Link to Post: Link to Post

They'd have to be some very small crutches or very large rings. Razz

I third DL's words. Proper tools (which contrary to the DL and lorraine show, don't HAVE to be Xurons Razz) and practicing techniques go a LONG way.

Joined: September 02, 2003
Posts: 115
Submissions: 0
Location: Darwin, Australia

Reply with quote
Posted on Wed Feb 13, 2013 2:32 am
Link to Post: Link to Post

Ugh, I use Tool Dip and no matter how hard I try, seem to mar rings without it. Especially white AA from TRL (grah!!). I find it very hard to work fast and reliably not scratch without Tool Dip, and it lasts for ages. I have a pair dried ready to go when the coating on the current pair eventually gives out. I don't need Tool Dip on not-AA though.

Joined: October 3, 2012
Posts: 11
Submissions: 2
Location: Boise, ID

Reply with quote
Posted on Wed Feb 13, 2013 4:04 am
Link to Post: Link to Post

Sometimes people forget that the tool, pliers in this case, are an extension of your hand. Those pliers will do nothing without your permission. If you find you are marring your rings, try a lighter grip, or an cheesy exercise I was taught by an electrician for a proper pliers grip.

Palm up, lay the pliers in your hand so they balance.
Place your thumb on the outside handle and gently press forward until the jaw moves.
Wrap your fingers gently around the other handle. Squeeze the pliers shut with a natural motion. Your hand should remained relaxed, like you're holding an egg.

It took me a while to get the feel for the right pressure applied to the grips (handles) to not be too tight, but still hold the ring in place without slipping or marring the ring. A lot of it is getting used to the feel and weight of the tool in your hand. Remember your hand / wrist movements control the pliers, the pliers simple hold the ring.

I'll shut up now.


One ringy dingy, two ringy dingy, *snort, snort, snort*

Joined: November 16, 2011
Posts: 13
Submissions: 2
Location: New Mexico

Not a crutch for me
Reply with quote
Posted on Sun Feb 24, 2013 1:28 am || Last edited by ChainOfBeauty on Sun Feb 24, 2013 6:38 pm; edited 1 time in total
Link to Post: Link to Post

Crutch or not, I swear by Tool Magic.

I can't tolerate any scratches on sterling silver rings, even though I'll put the pieces in a tumbler when the chain is finished. I think that any marring reduces not only the beauty of the pieces but also the value.

If I were using stainless steel or some other hard metal, I suppose this wouldn't be a problem, but it is a problem with silver.

Additionally, any coated or colored rings seem particularly prone to marring, which can expose the base metal underneath.

To me, this is simply an issue of ensuring I produce the most beautiful pieces possible. In fact, I keep three pairs of pliers so I can keep going when the Tool Magic begins to wear off the first (or second) pair.

Price: $5 - $8. One jar lasts a long time.

I won't make any recommendation about what YOU should do, nor will I ridicule you for your methods. I'm only explaining what I do and why.




Combining art and technique

Joined: January 13, 2013
Posts: 454
Submissions: 16
Location: GA

Reply with quote
Posted on Sun Feb 24, 2013 1:51 am
Link to Post: Link to Post

I tried the Tool Magic ... I will just call it "training wheels" Wink

Joined: May 07, 2008
Posts: 3615
Submissions: 149
Location: Germany, Herxheim

Reply with quote
Posted on Sun Feb 24, 2013 1:24 pm
Link to Post: Link to Post

I don't see why we need this discussion at all - we use tools for doing the job, and tend to use tools suitable to do the job well. Different tasks need different tools. And once you see a coating being PART OF the tool for a particular class of jobs, you can be well with, if it serves to fulfill the task.

See that I use most times uncoated pliers, and even roughen the plier jaw surfaces of some of mine to avoid slipping, I have also always some pairs of coated ones around - used seldom, but from time to time. I think it's a matter of false pride, if one avoids consciously the use of an available tool.

OTOH, this can lead also to inflexibility, if one uses a particular tool modification always, even if not needed. Then the pendulum swung too far, and you're caught again in the pride trap. Be always open, test what suits you best for a particular task, and never deny yourself from trying something yet new to you. You can always discard a method, that doesn't work for you, but never try to force others in an 'armed-missionar' like manner to follow your own path. A bit persuading is allowed, nevertheless; I do that all the time.

-ZiLi-


Maille Code V2.0 T7.1 R5.6 Ep Fper MAl Ws$ Cpbsw$ G0.3-6.4 I1.0-30.0 N28.25 Ps Dacdejst Xagtw S08 Hip

Human societies are like chain mail.
A single link will be worth nothing.
A chain is of use, but will break at the weakest link.
A weak weave will have the need to replace weak links.
A strong weave will survive even with weak links included.
-'me

Joined: March 29, 2005
Posts: 500
Submissions: 26
Location: Plumstead, London

Reply with quote
Posted on Sun Feb 24, 2013 3:50 pm
Link to Post: Link to Post

I tend to agree with ZiLi on this. Don't use tool magic? Bully for you. Do use it? bully for you too. There is no "one size fits all" solution for making.

That said isn't the pride (and bragging rights, if such things are healthy) in what WAS made? Not HOW it was made?

We can say this using tool magic is slightly more expensive than not doing so. That's about it. If you can do without it, it will save you a bit of money.

The fact is your making; that's the important thing. Hell, I don't care if you close links with your feet whilst singing "onward christian solders".

Whatever works to get the job done.

I used tin vice covers when working with soft metals (bend the tin not the work) That was taught to me by a man who had spent 50 years metalworking. I would not have DARED to accuse him of using a "crutch" it's not a crutch, it's a trick.

Joined: January 13, 2013
Posts: 454
Submissions: 16
Location: GA

Reply with quote
Posted on Sun Feb 24, 2013 4:31 pm
Link to Post: Link to Post

ClymAngus wrote:
I tend to agree with ZiLi on this. Don't use tool magic? Bully for you. Do use it? bully for you too. There is no "one size fits all" solution for making.

That said isn't the pride (and bragging rights, if such things are healthy) in what WAS made? Not HOW it was made?

We can say this using tool magic is slightly more expensive than not doing so. That's about it. If you can do without it, it will save you a bit of money.

The fact is your making; that's the important thing. Hell, I don't care if you close links with your feet whilst singing "onward christian solders".

Whatever works to get the job done.

I used tin vice covers when working with soft metals (bend the tin not the work) That was taught to me by a man who had spent 50 years metalworking. I would not have DARED to accuse him of using a "crutch" it's not a crutch, it's a trick.

*hehe*

I have heard other people recommend the covers too.

As I am getting better with each piece I do; I find the biggest problem with AA.

Joined: March 29, 2005
Posts: 500
Submissions: 26
Location: Plumstead, London

Reply with quote
Posted on Sun Feb 24, 2013 4:37 pm
Link to Post: Link to Post

When your done, (and most importantly, YOUR happy with your work, you are your own harshest critic after all). We would love to see some pictures.

The more the merrier on this strange creative odyssey. Very Happy

Post new topic Reply to topic
Jump to:  
Page 1 of 1
All times are GMT. The time now is Mon Sep 16, 2019 9:09 pm
M.A.I.L. Forum Index -> Knitting Circle
Display posts from previous: